Caleb Rybalka wrote:That range is incomplete.
KQ, KJ, K8 all raise here too.
The player limped from early position. Therefore KK, QQ, JJ are all unlikely. So the only hands you are behind to are A10 & 10 9.
That raise is just someone smashing the pot button for whatever reason. It most cases I find (with reads) that is trying in their own way to get value for a hand they think is ahead. Usually not the nuts though. You really are crushing the range here.
I just wouldn't ever fold the turn here.
I'm check calling river if board bricks, re-evaluating if the texture changes.
Playing mathematically sound is fine, but then you are at someones mercy if they keep smashing the pot button.
Hi Caleb, the range is not incomplete.
I've deliberately excluded KQ / KJ from the range for the same reasons i excluded AA KK QQ JJ - because those hands are being opened for a raise pre flop most of the time,
especially when first to act.
K8 I also excluded deliberately because there's no way ABC opponents are limping K8 from UTG+1 in a nine or ten handed tournament as a common occurrence. Remember - when assigning a range we are considering the most likely action of our opponents PF - and K8 is a standard fold to an every day opponent call Mr Joe Regular
from EP.
Even J8 suited would be more regularly limped because it's being played for it's connectedness - straights and flushes, not just the K high flush value. But whatever, include the K8 if you must, the equation doesn't change anyway.
Your still a 52% favourite and gambling your whole tournament life when there's really no need. You'll have better opportunities to get it in when it's still so early and your deep stacked.
Folding is fine.
Calling totally sucks. Why on earth would you call when you have two straights on the board already beating you? (AT / T9). Calling also gives your opponent a further chance to suck out on you if he's on two pair or a funky straight draw.
Shoving is marginally ok based on likely ranges. Your range
is not crushing your opponents most likely raising range, it's a coin flip. Remember - this is a limped pot & your suddenly facing a very large 3 bet on the turn - so the assigned hand ranges against board texture are accurately assessed as follows:-
Range equation:-
K8QJ board:
888 vs TT,ATs,QJs,JTs,J8s,T9s,ATo,QJo,JTo,T9o
888 = 52% equity
TT,ATs,QJs,JTs,J8s,T9s,ATo,QJo,JTo,T9o = 48% equity
with K8s and K8o included - 53% equity.
These ranges are all player dependant and can be edited based on history, but we're assuming no history here so you apply the most likely balanced range and act accordingly.
I could elaborate further to hammer this point to accurate death, but I have to play you people from time to time so I'll leave everything else in the bag.
If anyone wants further discussion just pm me.
Kind regards
rR
ps.......
Caleb Rybalka wrote:Playing mathematically sound is fine, but then you are at someones mercy if they keep smashing the pot button.
Incorrect. I am never at the mercy of a "smashing pot button" opponent. I just selectively choose when to pull the trigger.
Conversely, you are most definitely at the mercy of the bet pot button opponent by just calling in these spots. fold or shove.
