Salary cap in Football - good or bad?

[Bacon]

OK.. so the list is capped at 42 players plus 2 extra spots for either rookies or veterans or there's 42 players plus a possible 2 spots for rookies as well as 2 spots for veterans?

The rookie list is separate. It has 4 places, but up to 6 for this year. Sydney & Brisbane get extra spots for local players. And if you have only 1 veteran, I think you get an extra rookie spot.

I think it's 40+2 vets actually.

What currently happens when a club wants to acquire a player from another club? Is there a transfer fee involved (ie buying the player) or is it purely down to swapping draft picks and/or other players?

It can only be arranged during trade week. However the Draft also can be used to move clubs. No transfer fee (unless you do a Veale Deal, where a dud player was traded for a pick, on the proviso they didn't use their first PSD pick on another player)

[bennymacca]

the list is actually 38 players

in addition to this, there are 4 rookies. rookies are usually players that are under long term development. they are paid minimum wage, and are not allowed to play games.

having said this however, if someone gets injured, they can be placed on a long term injury list for a minimum period of 8 weeks. for this time, a rookie can be promoted. (this can also happen in the case of mid season retirements)

veteran players have to be on the list of 38 players, but not all of their payments contribute towards the salary cap. this is to stop clubs paying their aging stars less, and them getting pissed off and leaving for 1 year at the end of their careers, which isn't good for player or club. its sort of like a loyalty bonus.

when players change clubs, there is no transfer fee - players and draft picks are traded for players.

if the players are out of contract, they can move freely between clubs, which clubs hate because then they get nothing for the player.

in november each year, there is a trade week where each club can trade players and or draft picks to others.

in January of each year, they have a draft for all of the young players. in this time each club has to turn over at least 3 (or is it 4?) players. the clubs take it in turns for picks, with the crap clubs getting the higher picks

in january of each year, they have a second draft. this is for out of contract players so that they can move clubs.

clubs can delist players whenever they want, and these clubs can join other clubs at a later date as well.

[Bacon]

the list is actually 38 players

correct

in addition to this, there are 4 rookies. rookies are usually players that are under long term development. they are paid minimum wage, and are not allowed to play games.

Up to 6 for 2009 season

having said this however, if someone gets injured, they can be placed on a long term injury list for a minimum period of 8 weeks. for this time, a rookie can be promoted. (this can also happen in the case of mid season retirements)

But only retirements due to injury, not for being shit.

veteran players have to be on the list of 38 players,

Incorrect. There can be 2 veterans outside the normal list. For each vacant veteran spot, you can take another rookie.

but not all of their payments contribute towards the salary cap. this is to stop clubs paying their aging stars less, and them getting pissed off and leaving for 1 year at the end of their careers, which isn't good for player or club. its sort of like a loyalty bonus.

Must be over 30, and 10 years at the club.

when players change clubs, there is no transfer fee - players and draft picks are traded for players.

if the players are out of contract, they can move freely between clubs, which clubs hate because then they get nothing for the player.

But players can only sign for another club via the National Draft or the Pre-Season Draft. You can't just sign up to a club that you like.

in november each year, there is a trade week where each club can trade players and or draft picks to others.

This is in October, it's next week!

in January of each year, they have a draft for all of the young players. in this time each club has to turn over at least 3 (or is it 4?) players. the clubs take it in turns for picks, with the crap clubs getting the higher picks

It occurs in November, and it is a minimum of 3 picks. In reserve order of the ladder at the end of the Finals series.

in january of each year, they have a second draft. this is for out of contract players so that they can move clubs.

The AFL is trying to phase this out, by forcing all clubs to finalise their lists prior to the ND.

clubs can delist players whenever they want, and these players can join other clubs at a later date as well.

Can only sign for a AFL club via a Draft (ND or PSD).

[bennymacca]

you are correct bacon, by changing clubs, i meant through the pre-season draft, which doesn't really mean much anyway, as clubs aren't gonna take players that have in principle agreements with other clubs.

with regards to the veterans, i was not aware that they were outside of the list, thanks for clearing that up bacon.

[Bacon]

No worries.

14.1 Each AFL Club shall maintain minimum and maximum numbers of Players on their Lists. During the term, the maximum Primary List size shall be 38 and Veterans List size shall be 2.
14.2 The minimum number of Players on the Club’s Primary List and Veterans List combined shall be 38.

I just wanted to clarify that, let's take Ben Cousins as an example. He can't just go and sign up for Essendon, now that he's no longer an Eagles player. If he's cleared by the AFL to play, he still has to go into the draft.

On the salary cap Pete, there are plenty of rules about what is & isn't included. Like match payments to rookies, who are elevated to play for an LTI, are NOT included. I had thought they were.

Finals games match payments are not in the salary cap (fair enough).

50% of a rookie's contract not included.

The Top 5 draft pick recognition payments are not (I never heard of this)

First Round Draft Choice players who are selected in the top five (5) draft picks in the National Draft shall receive from the AFL a one off payment of the amount set out opposite the position in the draft the Player was selected:
Pick 1 $10,000
Pick 2 $5,000
Pick 3 $5,000
Pick 4 $2,500
Pick 5 $2,500
Players who receive this benefit shall provide such promotional assistance as the AFL may reasonably require in connection with the promotion of the game of Australian rules football during their first year as a listed AFL player.

Here's the currentAFL Collective Bargaining Agreement

Interesting reading...

Cyril Rioli would've been paid nicely this year.$50,200 base salary, + $2400 per match, plus $6,900 bonus for playing 11+ games in 1st year.

Almost $110,000 for the year, not including Finals match payments. Sheesh.

[BigPete33]

Can anyone give a good reason why a club HAS to spend a certain % of their wage allocation?

Likewise for HAVING to move 3 or players from their list?

[maccatak11]

Pete, clubs can have 42 players on their regular lsit. Veterans are included outside of this number, and clubs can have up to 6 rookies (more if you count the 'international rookies' that some clubs experiment) also outside of this regular number.


The only player swapping that happens between clubs is in the november "trade week' where clubs can swap draft picks and/or players for other draft picks and/or players. Clubs cannot buy players from other clubs.

Later in november, youngsters are drafted in a draft. After this time, clubs finalise positions on their list, and players can be de-listed or hot have their contracts renewed.

After this there is also a pre-season draft where yougsters who missed out on the previous draft, and uncontracted older players can be drafted by other clubs.

No exchange of players can occur mid season. In the late days of the VFL/ early days of the AFL there was a mid-season draft, but this no longer occurs.

[Bacon]

Can anyone give a good reason why a club HAS to spend a certain % of their wage allocation?

Likewise for HAVING to move 3 or players from their list?

No, not really. But the CBA does say that if the club doesn't pay 92.5% of the TPP (Total Player Payments), the club has to pay the difference to the AFL.

[bennymacca]

its an interesting question

it means that the stars from each team essentially get paid the same. which is weird, because gary ablett is probably getting the same as say cameron bruce or russell robertson, because these are the best players at melbourne.

that means that those players aren't ever going to change clubs, becuase they are getting paid more than what they would be worth at other clubs.

it also means that melbourne will find it hard to fit someone else in the salary cap if someone like daniel kerr comes along, becasue the other so called stars of the team are locked in on high paying contracts.

i think the reason that there is a floor is so that poor clubs don't skimp on paying players. if they do this then the even-ness of the competition suffers

[rcon]

The AFL's socialist policies do create some moral hazards tho, in that clubs don't have to live with the full consequences of poor management - spend enough time at the bottom of the ladder, and you'll be rewarded with quality recruits, or even negotiate a poor stadium deal, and the AFL will bail you out.

Players at poor clubs know they are going to get paid a chunk of cash from a pie the same size as premiership club players, what motivation do they have to strive for perfection? This last point isn't quite worded right, but you get the idea.

I sorta like it 'cause I know my team (GO YOU MIGHTY BOMBERS!) will rise again soon, but really, they should never have been down the bottom - we have much cash, and a great club, recruiting and paying for talent would not be a problem except for the salary cap! Now other clubs are being rewarded for their mediocrity, and we are paying the price.