Cowboys shotup in a shootout.

[BigPete33]

So you'll call with a marginal hand in most any other scenario because you might win a large pot yet you'll advocate folding preflop in this situation with a hand you should be winning with?

Isn't part of the reason for those value calls in order to give yourself a better chance of success should you win big?

I think it's completely counter-productive to fold AA in a situation where not only you can achieve exactly that but you are reasonably expected to do so, and in the later stages of a tourney to boot.

You've taken bigger risks than that before Mafau!

[krunchie]

well said pete

i am in complete agreement

[Des]

But online poker is rigged and the software is giving you AA or KK to make sure you call the all-ins and will then screw you over.

[Scotty]

So you'll call with a marginal hand in most any other scenario because you might win a large pot yet you'll advocate folding preflop in this situation with a hand you should be winning with?

Isn't part of the reason for those value calls in order to give yourself a better chance of success should you win big?

I think it's completely counter-productive to fold AA in a situation where not only you can achieve exactly that but you are reasonably expected to do so, and in the later stages of a tourney to boot.

You've taken bigger risks than that before Mafau!

In the same spot, the 'marginal' hands you are talking about are also being folded.

The crux of the thread, really, is whether AA is good against 2 or 3 all ins, which in turn put you all in, on a bubble that carries some significance.

[AceLosesKing]

If you have the chips to safely fold down for an orbit (or 3) without being affected by blinds and antes, I don't see why you wouldn't fold AA (in that bubble situation).

[rcon]

So you'll call with a marginal hand in most any other scenario because you might win a large pot yet you'll advocate folding preflop in this situation with a hand you should be winning with?

It goes back to the tournament structure - bubbling pays no money, which by its very definition, isn't very valuable

Isn't part of the reason for those value calls in order to give yourself a better chance of success should you win big?

Of course, but is comes back to why are you playing in a tournament? If your SOLE goal is to win, and you're not fussed about cashing, you might make the call - but again, does AA play that well against 3 other hands?

I think it's completely counter-productive to fold AA in a situation where not only you can achieve exactly that but you are reasonably expected to do so, and in the later stages of a tourney to boot.

Again, does AA play so well against so many hands? People are always complaining AA ALWAYS gets cracked (no, it doesn't) because they overvalue it - it is just one paid after all. Sure, you're likely to dominate 1 of the players, say AQs/AKs, someone might have KK, someone might even have QQ/JJ - you're dodging a number of cards, with very few ways for your hand to improve...

You've taken bigger risks than that before Mafau!

And I'd make the action with AA for sure, but calling with 3 prev all-ins, when I'd really like to cash? Nope. NPL? for sure

It is an interesting discussion anyway - similar to the all-in first hand of a deep stack with AA.

[Todd Rivers]

So you put $50 into the pokies. You win $200 in 1 spin. Do you hit double - up? Or take the win? You take the win and play some more.

Why risk losing it all on a 50-50 (i know Aces arent 50/50 but do you see my point?).

[Todd Rivers]

So you put $50 into the pokies. You win $200 in 1 spin. Do you hit double - up? Or take the win? You take the win and play some more.

Why risk losing it all on a 50-50 (i know Aces arent 50/50 but do you see my point?).

Bad example really as i hardly ever play pokies, hate em actually.

But if i want FTW i call, but i want to build my bankroll first, then take risks with other peoples money, not mine.

[bennymacca]

in a tournament, what would you be happier with

cashing every time, but making say 180 from your 100 buyin

or not cashing 5 in 6 times, but that 6th time you run really deep and make final table


i would suggest that you dont make a really really good ROI unless you run deep - and you are never going to do that unless you take your opportunities when you get them.

so unless it was a satellite seat on the line, i would cross my fingers and shove all my chips in there.


ill just run it in poker stove AA against 3 other players

if i assume that the other players are shoving with any 2 random cards, then aces are approx 64% against 3 other players


(in fact, i just ran it with the other players only playing top 10% of hands, and the result is much the same)

so, its 64% chance of massive stack and basically final tabling, or 100% chance of getting an early cash

i know which one i am taking, and its not the early cash

[BigPete33]

I actually had the AA situation fairly recently. Can't recall which of the 2 tourneys it was but it was either the AM satellite or the SF the next day and it was late-ish in the tourney.

Late position and look down at AA, 2 allins before me and 1 caller who had change.


Couldn't call quick enough!


Knocked out the 2 allins and severely crippled the other caller.