What IS it with this new 'trend' of overplaying flush draws?

[AJG]

This is something I have noticed only recently, and mainly in 888PL online games, but other sites aswell. People overplaying, even pushing, with a flush draw. And it doesnt even need be the NFD, nor do they need be short-stacked.

Take this hand:

hand1.jpg (24.8 KiB) Viewed 587 times

nigel chk-calls the flop, where his chances are hitting the flush are highest, then pushes over the top of me on the turn

Sidenote: Hand History was converted to a jpg using a small program I am writing as AceLosesKing suggested one would be a good idea, and i agree. An uploadable jpg was the best solution I could come up with. It is not quite 'releasable' yet, but if people are interested, it will be soon... Still a few minor things to work out (ie pot size on the river when an allin is called but not met fully). Please note it is written specifically for 888.com's Hand History format.
Output of program is a not so compressed, hence cleare,r jpg... ( but I needed to use a cropping tool, until it is completed.
Any feedback most welcome and appreciated...

[Brett Kay]

i have 15 outs. Thats usually pretty good.

As i said, if some people took the time to work out where they were in a hand, it would be a lot easier for them to fold. Others look and go i have a flush chance and i have a straight chance, easy i can push and hit it.

Remember they are the ones making the mistakes by overplaying the hand, it is the same as Aces. I am guilty of overplaying a few hands when i have second or 3rd pair on the board. But on the same token, i keep pots small regardless of what i am doing, just to reduce the risk of someone pushing.

My favourite at the moment is the super push, 1200 pot, all in for 30k. Value bet or what. Few hands last night, where i could have gotten into trouble, but too big preflop bets meant i was out and wasn't overplaying the hand.

[AJG]

i have 15 outs. Thats usually pretty good.

As i said, if some people took the time to work out where they were in a hand, it would be a lot easier for them to fold. Others look and go i have a flush chance and i have a straight chance, easy i can push and hit it.

Remember they are the ones making the mistakes by overplaying the hand, it is the same as Aces.
I know, just gets annoying when they seem to hit more often than they should

....

My favourite at the moment is the super push, 1200 pot, all in for 30k. Value bet or what. ...

Or allin preflop for 2.5K with 30/60 blinds! (and only winning the blinds) What the hell is going on here? Sometimes I think people just like the 'idea' of being allin, like its a rush for them or somethin (live games). I wonder what the percentages are of these players winning a tournament (large MTT, not 27 players) or even making the FT or the $$$?

I am trying to workout, by talking to ppl at away events and other live poker and also here on this forum, is where people get the idea that its a good idea to play this way. Sorry to all those who do, but its NOT good poker, its gambling, relying on chance alone... go down an put your $$ in the pokies, you can win even BIGGER there!
Did they see a shortstack shove and river a flush to double up on TV and not truly understand the situation? Are they just playing on luck? Or do they not want to get outplayed, so just stick it allin earlier than the river and hope for the best

Especially preflop I HATE allin, you will remember last night I only raised (then folded to a shove and reshove) with JJ, and same with AA but I called the shove with Aces... I don't like having all my chips in and being completely at the mercy of the deck!
In that hand above, even his preflop call with K3 is pretty horrible I think, and as I said why chk-call the flop, then go so hard on the turn? Nothin changed for him except that he only has 1 card left to hit his draws on...

[bennymacca]

I don't like having all my chips in and being completely at the mercy of the deck!

on the flip side, you are missing out on a TON of value by playing conservatively

every single time i get dealt aces or kings, i am looking to get it in preflop - ride the wave or variance i say!

just thought i would emphasise preflop here

[Brett Kay]

This is where your game needs to evolve. Pushing all in preflop with aces and kings, trying to embrace the variance, whilst seems sound i theory, also means you lose value from the calling stations that have to see a flop.

There have been a few hands that i have had to play differently than what i normally do, because of certain players tendencies. E.g. Min betting a 10bb pot, with Ace high all the way to the river. Whilst they play this way, it means that they will lose more chips by firing on all the streets.

Then again, there are a lot of other players that are missing out on value, by not raising, or overbetting hands. How many times, have we had the calling station roll over a set of aces or kings. And we were betting at them.

Pretty much you are looking to maintain your edge in the hand. If you can't put them on a hand, play the hand out and see what they turn over, if it becomes too expensive - fold its not worth the risk sometimes.

As for going all in preflop, i hate the move in general, Would rather raise, reraise, all in situation, gain a few extra bets here and there out of it.

[bennymacca]

i am only talking about preflop brett, obviousl postflop is different

[trishan]

Nigel Hart makes my blood boil. He is a luckbox who has no poker skills. He is also abusive. Should be banned IMHO

[AceLosesKing]

I love going all in preflop. Saves work on later streets.

[Brett Kay]

There are a few out there that mouth off online, Think ALK can do me the honours of the pic. But i usually sit on the stats or the third tab, mainly don't have to get tilted by the chat.

THough sometimes there are some good chats out there. So far have been called a d-nky, supposedly i like to give head. Also that i have no clue what i am doing. All in all, i think the more people that think i play loose the better advantages i have to my gameplay. LOL. Also i am not afraid to make bad calls, just so people think they know how i am playing. I can usually gain extra chips because there ace might be good.

[AceLosesKing]